Track lending & borrowing activities

Tracking lending and borrowing is actually very helpful,

I wish we would have get a summary of debt, like if a person took debt multiple times and paid in instalment, it would to better if we get a summary to share with that person

Amit Mohan Hi Amit, I appreciate your efforts and endeavour to incorporate user feedback.

I have 2 small improvement suggestion for Debt feature that is available in Beta.

1. A provision for entering opening balance with or without tagging a particular account - currently it is mandatory that one has to select one account. Issue - say I want to enter debt from now (feature available now) - and if I choose a particular account then the balance of that account would go for a toss.

2. Move the debt account(s) to main page of accounts - type of account. And user should be able to select (like all other accounts) whether one wants to see consolidated account along with debt accounts or not.

Please feel free to get in touch or if you would like to hear more.

Thanks and regards,

Abhas

Amit Mohan it will really helpfull if you extend for the loans like car loan etc with interest component,

Because now i am able to track the loan w.r.t principal what left but how much i am paying as interst that is not possible...

Required we can connect on this to disscuss more...

But till that thanks and waiting for the more updates...

There should be an option to add interest on the amount lent. Currently, there's no way to record interest on the given amount, but I usually charge interest on loans. Please add this feature to Debts to accurately track the total amount owed, including interest.

Amit Mohan

I just got the update. The first look is amazing.

Amit Mohan

Hey Amit,

I am really excited about the feature being in progress. Is it possible to give a estimate of when this feature might get released for beta.

How to join the BETA program

Any update, by when we can see lending and borrowing feature.

Yes, just like Khata book app.

Nice ,It was required

Amit Mohan

Hey Amit,

Thanks for making a new mock up flow. It makes it much easier, than text, to imagine how the feature would work and talk about any improvements.

1 - After analysing both of these flows, I can see how the 2nd flow would not allow for a debit progress bar. In my opinion, and use case for this feature, it is not a very important element.

2.1 - As for the total debt amount, I think it is still possible for that to be calculated as you have already illustrated in the 2nd flow 'debit page'.

2.2 - In the 2nd flow, the way you use the red and green colours throughout the UI makes it very easy to understand if the record is an asset or a liability. Using that you can calculate the total amount of money you have lent or borrowed same as the 1st flow.

3 - I really like how you designed the totals in the 2nd flow 'history page', it is exactly how I would expect this feature to be implemented.

4 - I am suggesting that you allow these name/person accounts to change their account type (lent or borrowed) according to their overall records. Meaning, if the lent amount is more than the borrowed amount turn the account green, therefore making it a lent type account, and vice versa, irrespective of its starting account type.

5.1 - This has a few advantages:-

5.2 - No need to maintain multiple lent and borrowed accounts, for the same person, of different amounts.

5.3 - This way it will be compatible for single time use cases (like for what 1st flow is designed for) and multiple time use cases (like the example I gave about my sister) with the only sacrifice being the debit progress bar

5.4 - This way you can adjust the lent and borrowed records of the same person with a single record where as in the 1st flow you would have to make 2 records across 2 name/person accounts for the same person.

6 - I am giving you these examples and suggestions because, as you said, this feature is going to be designed mainly to be used for family and friends but family and friends don't normally engage in one time lent or borrow situations, that the 1st flow is trying to achieve.

7 - Instead the 2nd flow would be way more compatible with family and friends situations as sometimes you don't pay your family, you make purchases on behalf of you parents like buying groceries, etc.

It's fine, if you don't agree with my perspective but at the very least give it some though.

Amit Mohan

Hey Amit,

Thanks for the quick reply. I appreciate you for taking the time to read my comments and answering my questions.

1.1 - Ok, thanks for confirming that.

1.2 - I see, there is an empty spot there so it would fit well.

2 - 👍

3 - Understood.

4 - Happy to help.

5 - ok

8 - ok

Check the next comment for my thoughts about the updated flow. I will send it in a bit.

6.1 I don't like the way the 'add record flow' flow is designed. By looking at its preview, the way i understand how the flow is going to be is that you make a lent or borrowed account and once the lent or borrowed money is returned or given back the account is to be closed or archived.

6.2 And, either you will have a 'borrow more' or 'lent more' option according to the type of account (lent or borrowed) you want to add a record in.

ignore point 7 if i am wrong about point 6

7. For instance, me and my sister regularly lent or borrow money to or from each other. According to how i understand the record flow, I would have to make a lent and borrow account with my sister's name and would have to make regular adjustments.

8. What are your thoughts about scheduled transactions for lent and borrowed records? For example, i get pocket money from my father on a weekly basis. It would be great to have scheduled transactions to automate that record.

I know it's a long message but I still hope you can find the time to consider these points while working on this feature.

Amit Mohan Hey Amit,

It's good to see that you are actively working towards this new feature. I really like this initial preview of the different pages and their design. From the start, I love the interface and UI of the app. You have done a great job there.

I would like to bring your attention to some use cases and questions that i have regarding this feature and how it will be integrated into the app. I will try to keep it short and would like to hear your and others thoughts.

1.1 The 'debit page' is perfect. I am guessing that to get to 'add debit flow' you have to go to 'debit page' and then press the + icon.

1.2 If that is the case I suggest to make the 'debit page' easily accessible. For that you can move the + icon from the center to the lower right (Like in the image above). That will make space for another tab, where the + icon was before, where you can add the option to access the 'debit page'.

2. Add the option to record date and time for the 'add record flow' and 'add debit flow'.

3. Will the lend and borrowed records show in the 'recent transactions' space in home tab and Transactions page (where you can see and sort and filter all transactions)

4. In the 'history page', add a option to edit balance, like in accounts for adjustments, so that adjustments can be made in cases like where the lent money turns into a bad debt.

5. I am assuming that to get to the 'add record flow' you have open the 'history page' of some person and then select the + icon.

Currently I manage borrowed money as negative as it intrest free and for interestable liabilities as bank account with total payable amount as negative and edit amount quarterly if any changes in total payable amount. And whenever I make payment towards liabilities, add them as tranfer. Also this liabilities don't impact my total balance so I skip it from bank account total which is premium feature.

Hey Amit Mohan, will there be a way to notify the borrower that the money has been paid or borrowed? Maybe via a text message?

This is great feature. +1

Amit Mohan when are we going to get this update?

Hey Amit Mohan any update on this feature? Please keep updating so that we can add any feedback

Amit Mohan Any update on this?

This will be a good feature

Amit Mohan i think this seems perfect.

Hi Amit Mohan, Thank you for the reply...

I suggest prioritizing the lending and borrowing feature as first and then if implementing the interest is complicated as it could differ for each person.

Just giving a field where one can enter it manually of the interest amount is one option.

so people who doesn't use interest in borrowing and lending also can use it easily and people who want to use the interest feature also can use...

but only caveat is they have to work the calculation outside and enter the amount... so that's up to you to choose based on the complexity of coding... but I feel the basic borrowing and lending feature is important as it affects the main purpose of financial management... as we couldn't specifically know how much is my actual balance and to plan my expense accordingly...

Amit Mohan Please, It will be helpful if we get before Jan- 2025. I mean Dec 1st or 2nd week. So that we can keep track for this year and pull report for this year for analysis. Are you adding lending and borrow in report download section. If you add at the end of report it will be helpful.

@Amit Mohan When this update is being rolled out?

Amit Mohan It's better to have simple tracking without interest rate.

Please add the feature so that we can track money given/lended or borrowed

Amit Mohan yeah keep it simple, without interest for now, so that we can keep track of basic lending. In future maybe you can have a toggle for advanced features and in that you can give the option for interests and all.

Amit Mohan Yes please keep it simple without interest and all things, your application’s USP is simplicity dont make it too complex

Amit Mohan This is a good head start and there can be feedback once we get to use the feature. So far so good 👍.

Amit Mohan Thanks for the update! I think keeping the feature simple and focusing on tracking lending and borrowing without interest rates is good in the initial stages. This approach would make it accessible and easy to use for everyone.

Amit Mohan I agree with you. Its better to keep it simple and straightforward, other wise it will just make the app complex to use and people will stop recording their transactions because of the added steps.

Adding interest rates would not only be difficult but would also not help a lot of people because there are different types and ways of how banks calculate interest rates. Even if you get the interest rates correct and calculate it correctly, still the actual amount might be different because of some other charge or something.

Amit Mohan yes keep it simple, currently either we have to create income and exp for lending or create a dummy account under bank for lending and reimbursement

So simple lending and reimbursement will impact our balance in current UI and whatever receivable and payable will be on that new UI

Amit Mohan I think it's better to launch without interest part. Adding interest stuff will definitely complicate it for a lot of users. Many may want to just document the lending & borrowing from friends/family without any interest amount on it.

Amit Mohan

I really like the idea that the debt entries doesn't mix with real spending and income. It need to be a seperate section that will not not collide each other.(Maybe we can add a option like it can be calculated and seen in the account section- available balances. Now we can choose what to show in the total available balances right, so maybe if someone wishes to add ther debts or borrowing to their total balance can also choose to see there).

Amit Mohan Yes, it's better to prioritise adding this feature without interest for now and keep the idea of interest open for future updates.

Yes, it's required in any financial situation

Amit MohanWhen will the feature gets released? Just an approx date also would help a lot...

I think this can be achieved by lending feature that is planned I guess

Pls design it to calculate actual networth.

Amit Mohan

I would suggest adding interest is not needed. Just helping with the lending and borrowing activity is perfect.

Amit Mohan brother for your information https://www.onemoney.in/ is payment aggregator started consolidating all bank account in one place making all the transaction in one place please not idfcfirst bank rollout expense tracking using this aggregator. I am using this feature of this bank. Please this generation is for automation rather than mannual and your focus on making app simple. In sometime near future your app will be useless. expense tracking feature will be inbuild in all bank app using this onemoney.in aggregator. I hope this suggestion will help you move forward for automation. Thank You

Amit Mohan brother purpose of this app tracking expense if we cant track interest purpose of this app not fulfill. and making simple is not focus area it should be tracking expense.

Amit Mohan no need of automated calculation of interest but this should be mannual input and should be visible on report

Amit Mohan adding interest doesn't complicate anything. Interest is actual spending which need to report on spending. Every loan there is advance amortization schedule is provideded. So it makes easy entry. Even uploading excel in desire format makes it easy. So it important to have interest option in loan and which is to be report on spending. Others it's worthless.

It would be nice if the borrower data is live updated on all users / pls refer splitwise app (ios)

Amit Mohan I agree with you.

But I think Rahul Jain's requirement can be met by adding a feature for Net worth tracker which also includes debt tracking, which can have interest option along with the principal outstanding option. As it will be there for any investment. The Net worth tracker can be manual entered with some projection as per the entered ROI. The details of investment and Debt outstanding can be manually entered periodically (daily/monthly/quarterly/or any other frequency). This feature can be just rough reference of present financial condition of any individual.

Amit Mohan Just curious on how the debts are going to be grouped by borrower. From the image shared, it looks like the borrower name is a plain string. Will this work similar to tags? Or will the user have to create an entity for each borrower?

Amit Mohan This approach is the way to go.

Manish Sharmaa It would be in closed alpha testing phase, not open to public yet.

Amit Mohan This looks good. Just like to know how would this interact with the rest of the app be it budgeting, analysis, etc.

Also, I hope you have considered this, if not, it will be easy to add person name in a transaction with autofill like in tags and also to add transaction for a person directly like in accounts.

Amit Mohan This was just a suggestion. You could also consider adding another option for splitting expenses with flatmates, friends, or for trip costs. There is an app called Axio that offers a perfect solution for splitting expenses. You might want to take a look at that feature in the app.

Snehith Perumalla try to add intrest option like with interest or interest free

Amit Mohan waiting for the feature...

Amit Mohan when this feature will be rollout. We are waiting eagerly.

Yes, definitely needed

Amit Mohan where i will get this feature as i am a beta user even after updating I'm not able to see this feature

Interested in this feature.

Please add this feature

Waiting desperately

This is the most required feature

I already asked this feature

Yes a negative expense item which reduces the expense of the same category, instead of showing as an income.

Best Feature.. Waiting

Hi Amit

I’m also expecting this feature, my case need to add refund transaction of credit card transaction.

Yes this feature will be a game changer